Starting a Business and Preparing for Crisis with Gino Wickman
Businesses all over the world have been hit hard by the new coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic. It came fast and it came so abruptly that it caught nearly everyone off guard. Today’s guest, Gino Wickman, says that this is all part of an entrepreneur’s life. The highs and lows of business are almost predictable and the only way to weather each storm is by making sure you’ve got your reserves, your wits, and your grit intact so that you can pick up the pieces and begin anew.
This is also the reason why for Gino, now is actually a pretty good time to ask yourself whether you’re meant to be an entrepreneur or not. He tackles this question and all the things that come with it in his book, The Entrepreneurial Leap. For Gino, worst-case scenarios will always play out in some form or another, what you need to do is to make sure you’ve got the things well prepared on your end so that you’re ready to push back and keep things steady.
Here’s the kicker: not everyone is meant to be an entrepreneur and that’s absolutely okay. This is why Gino encourages people to take part in his 16-day Entrepreneurial Leap Challenge so that you can start charting the course of your future today.
Gino Wickman is the creator of the Entrepreneurial Leap but he is best known as the Founder of the Entrepreneurial Operating System or EOS Worldwide. Gino is also the author of the best-selling book Traction, the book that popularized the business management system. He has written many other books in the series including Get A Grip, Rocket Fuel, How To Be A Great Boss, and What The Heck Is EOS?
If you’re someone interested in business, if you’re just starting out as an entrepreneur, or if you’re already an entrepreneur but don’t really know how to go forward, stay tuned to this episode of Culture Czars where you can get insights and learnings that will make you think and carefully consider the choices you’ve made and will be making in the future as an entrepreneur.
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Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
Gino Wickman explains why businesses need to have 6 months cash reserve
Gino talks about Entrepreneurial Leap and how it can help businesses cope with the effects of the COVID-19 pandemic
How to prepare for the worst-case scenarios in business
Gino explains why now is actually a good time to decide to be an entrepreneur
How Entrepreneurial Leap can help you determine if you’re an entrepreneur in the making
Gino explains that not everyone is designed to be an entrepreneur and why that’s okay
The role of an integrator in entrepreneurial companies and why it matters
Gino talks about the next steps for you if you have all the traits of an entrepreneur
What Gino’s glimpse can do for aspiring entrepreneurs
The importance of business in passion and how to get started on the entrepreneurial path
The value of mentorship in building your business
The power of purpose and passion in a person’s life
Discovering the 8 disciplines of the entrepreneurial path
The importance of feedback and why you need to be firm with your decisions
Why Gino advises entrepreneurs to save 15% of what they make in business
The role of culture in business
How to join Gino’s 16-day Entrepreneurial Leap Challenge
Resources Mentioned in this episode
Connect with Will
Episode Transcript
Automated:
From Core Values to Valued Culture, here is your host, Will Scott, interviewing another CEO about leading culture in their company.
Will Scott:
Okay, welcome to another Culture Czars interview, where we talk with CEOs that care about corporate culture. We call this series From Core Values to Valued Culture, and our purpose is to help CEOs create environments where people thrive, such that employees love where they work and have a purpose to why they work. My guest today is none other than Gino Wickman, now of E-Leap, but perhaps best known as the founder of the Entrepreneurial Operating System, or EOS, and the founder of EOS Worldwide. Gino's also author of the bestselling book, Traction, that popularized that business management system, and many other books in the series... two now, Gino. But I know that book has sold over a million copies worldwide. Gino, thanks for being on the show.
Gino Wickman:
It is a pleasure to be here, Will.
Will Scott:
Very excited to talk about your new venture, and E-Leap, and particularly, as it's so relevant to what's going on right now. This podcast may be listened to over the months and years, but just acknowledge that this is a very unique time for the entrepreneur and for the world at large. Let's start there, Gino. What are your thoughts about your new venture, E-Leap, and, in particular, at this time of coronavirus and the disease, COVID-19?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, timing is everything. I'll step into the answer to this question with creating a little context and something that my business mentor taught me almost 30 years now. He said, "Gino, in a 10-year business cycle, you're going to have two great years, six good years, and two years that will be terrible and potentially put you out of business." Since he taught me that 30 years ago, it has held true every decade. If we look back at the previous 100 years, and we look forward, I think it's going to hold true. So, here we are. That's point one.
Gino Wickman:
Point two is, I've been telling... We have 350 EOS Implementers around the world now. For the last probably seven years, I've been teaching and telling them this message from my mentor, and I say, "Get ready. It's coming, it's coming, it's coming. Be prepared to take a huge hit to your business. Have six months cash flow so you can sustain this." So, here we are. The two bad years have hit us. Who knows how long it's going to last. You said this is going to air in a week. It could all be over in a week. I doubt that. None of us are good enough to determine that, but for the ones that listen to me in the conversations I have with them, they are at total peace. Sadly, the ones that haven't listened, they're hurting right now.
Gino Wickman:
The first place I'd love to start with your question is just to... right now, if you're out there hurting, to listen to this advice, you're sitting there going, "Yeah, but what good is that going to do me now." But please, it's coming again. Between now and 10 years from now, you're going to get your ass kicked again. It's coming. Have six months cash reserve. So, if you are a company, if you have a business, please have dry powder, six months worth. Because those people that prepared well and knew it was coming, they're going to come out of this even stronger, and, unfortunately, they're probably going to buy three of their competitors. So, it's brutal. It's painful.
Gino Wickman:
The other thing I would suggest is what I learned... Ironically, my wife and I were in St. Lucia just as it was about to hit. Things weren't shut down yet, but I made a decision that I'm going to stay in paradise. We got home early Monday morning, a week and a half... two weeks ago, and I decided I'm going to enjoy paradise because, when I come back, I know I'm coming back to a shit storm.
Gino Wickman:
What I learned after about four days of being in the shit storm is I found that if I just talk to people and I help people and be a beacon of light for people, my energy was better. I became more optimistic. I got a ton of ideas. I realized, it was like Wednesday night, I started watching the news, sitting on the couch, sinking, started sucking my thumb, and just going to this very dark place. So, what I realized is if you just sit there alone and suck your thumb, you're going to be miserable. But if you get out and talk to people and help people, it is uplifting.
Gino Wickman:
Then the last little point I would make in answering your question is something came to me... With this new project, Entrepreneurial Leap, it's a passion project of mine to impact a million entrepreneurs in the making. It's crazy timing because I've written this book, I created something called the Leap Journal. The Journal is where you work your way through that journal one chapter at a time, 30 minutes a day commitment.
Gino Wickman:
So, I launched, on Tuesday, the 16 day Entrepreneurial Leap Challenge. It's like the perfect timing because people are sitting home, they're laid off, they're home from school, they've got nothing but time, and they make a 30 minute commitment a day to work their way through this journal and decide, is taking an entrepreneurial leap right for them. And the reality is, these are the times that new, great entrepreneurs are birthed. There are going to be a tremendous number of entrepreneurs that are created out of this. I hope to help a lot of them.
Will Scott:
Yeah, I love that. You're talking about helping people. I'm reminded that, as members of... at least I'm a current member of the Entrepreneurs' Organization, one of their values... or, sorry, the Entrepreneurial Operating System core values, right, for Implementers, is help first. I've been a party to a number of webinars and things where people are absolutely diving in to help first. I know I'm doing that too. Clients in need, just help now. Don't even talk about charging or anything like that. Just help first and, yeah, helping each other is a great way to go on that.
Gino Wickman:
Hear, hear.
Will Scott:
Going back to your two, six, two... and hopefully just remind people there's another six year period coming as well, so get ready for that. We're all going to prosper again. But, what about the two? Yes, we should get ready for a recession, but this was kind of... just came out of nowhere and came very, very quickly, didn't it? A bit more dramatic about how we came into this one. Anything different about the speed with which this happened?
Gino Wickman:
No, because let's go back to 100 years of history. I can't name all of the crises for you, but it comes fast, it comes slow, it's all... it's irrelevant. It's coming. So, it's happened, whether it's World War I, or II, or the Depression, or the H1N1, or the [inaudible 00:07:07]. We can go through all of them. '08, '09. The next 100 years, and the 10 more times this is going to happen, none of us can predict what that's going to be. If it's going to be a virus, if it's going to be a meteor hitting the earth, if it's... who knows, but it's coming, and it's going to jeopardize your business. It's going to rock you, and you've got to be prepared.
Gino Wickman:
You've got to... Nothing happens without an economy. With no economy, we're probably all going to die. So, you got to have cash flow. You got to be sitting on dry powder. You got to be prepared to get your ass kicked. What a world it would be if everyone on the planet had six months living expenses. That's even if you live on $1,000 a year or $10 million a year. That's an important secret formula to coming out of these crazy times.
Will Scott:
Yes, yes. I think I was telling you before we started recording, Gino, that I'm lucky enough to have a brand new client this week for Culture Czars. Someone that is starting a new business. He's always had this idea, but this timing now is perfect. So, he's kind of brought his plan forward, he's really pivoting, and going into a new business. I think part of your message is that this time is a great time for people to think about being an entrepreneur and starting a new business. What would you say to those folks who are thinking about it now and assessing the current situation?
Gino Wickman:
Well, selfishly, I would say read the book. As we get into the content of the book, it's everything we're about to talk about because I'm going to talk about first, confirm that you even are an entrepreneur in the making. We're going to talk about what that means and what those traits are. Number two is we're going to talk about the glimpse, and taking a look at what all of your possibilities are, because there's so many possibilities and opportunities. Then, we're going to talk about the path. Why we discourage... Please listen to the next 30 to 60 minutes of this and watch this podcast and read the book. The first 30 pages are available on the website for free, so you can just read those 30 pages if you can't afford to buy a book. And there's a ton of free tools. So, that's really what I would urge.
Gino Wickman:
But more importantly, maybe if you are a person sitting there wondering this, just please stay tuned right now because we're talking to you. In addition to that though, I know you have a lot of entrepreneurs that are watching this and they're successful. This is as much for an entrepreneur in the making as it is for anybody that cares about entrepreneurs. Because you have people in your life, your sons and daughters, your spouses, they are entrepreneurs in the making and this is their opportunity now. This is your opportunity for you to help them. So, I have two audiences. It's the people that care about entrepreneurs in the making, and it's people that are entrepreneurs in the making. This content, I really believe, is going to help them.
Will Scott:
That's a very helpful point to make, actually, because I know I'm, myself, a mentor both formally and informally to a number of entrepreneurs and kind of burgeoning businesses. So, it's a good message for everybody that the book E-Leap is not just for would-be entrepreneurs, it's for people that want to help entrepreneurs.
Gino Wickman:
Exactly. The book's called Entrepreneurial Leap. We lovingly call it E-Leap for short, but it's Entrepreneurial Leap-
Will Scott:
Oh, sorry.
Gino Wickman:
... in case you're looking for it. But the other thing I would suggest too, for any entrepreneur that's successful that's listening right now, what I never expected is how when you, whoever you are, read the book, it absolutely lights you up because you're about to read your life story. What I've written is scientific. There's not an ounce of theory. It is just from the real world, my 30 years of working with thousands of entrepreneurs. So, there is a little ancillary benefit for what it does when an entrepreneur reads this book.
Will Scott:
That's very cool. Well, let's start with step one then. The confirm stage. What does that look like?
Gino Wickman:
It's all about... the whole idea behind this is I'm taking the reader, who thinks they might be an entrepreneur, okay... There's two types of people. There are people that are true entrepreneurs in the making. They possess six essential traits, which I'm about to explain in a second. Then there's people that think they want to be an entrepreneur because it looks really cool. Well, the sad reality is, most people that want to be an entrepreneur, probably aren't. So, I'm going to break some hearts with this project, but I believe I'm going to save a lot of lives and save a lot of people from 10 years of hell, quite frankly.
Gino Wickman:
So, what I would say is first and foremost if you think that you might be an entrepreneur, I take you on this psychological, emotional, philosophical, soul searching, self discovery journey of figuring out if this is right for you. Again, it's three parts, like you said, and we said confirm, glimpse, and path.
Gino Wickman:
Confirm is all about first and foremost making sure that you have these six essential traits. Because, very importantly, you either do or you don't. You are born with them. It's nature over nurture. Every true entrepreneur has these. So, what are they? They are six essential traits. Visionary, passionate, problem solver, driven, risk taker, and responsible.
Will Scott:
Thank you. So, they will know at the end of, I don't know, chapter one or two, or something like early on in the book, they will have a strong sense of whether they are born to be, or whether that innate, natural desire and talent is there to be an entrepreneur?
Gino Wickman:
Exactly. So, read those first 30 pages, free on the website. See if it sucks you in. But I would say in the first third of the book, they'll ultimately know. Because once I paint the vivid picture and have them do a body scan four times, then I offer an assessment. That assessment is free on the website as well. But I offer an assessment. They take the assessment. I plead with you, whoever you are taking that assessment, be honest with yourself. You will do a disservice to yourself to kid yourself about this stuff. But they'll take an assessment and then they'll know. Once they know, then we take them to glimpse.
Gino Wickman:
Then I... I can't tell you how many times I try and talk people out of doing this because being an entrepreneur is not all it's cracked up to be. It's hard. It's tough. We spend more time getting our ass kicked than we do celebrating. But if they say, "Yes, this is me," then we take them to the next step and show them what their life will look like.
Will Scott:
Okay. To be clear, the best time to take that assessment is after the first 30 pages and they've read your work, not just go and take it right away?
Gino Wickman:
I would urge that you do that because at least you'll have more context and understanding, but somebody could go there and take it right now. But both would be ideal.
Will Scott:
That makes sense, yeah. You make a good point, being-
Gino Wickman:
Well, actually, here's what would be ideal is that they read the book, buy 100 copies for their friends and family, and then take the assessment. That's what would be ideal. Obviously I'm kidding, but...
Will Scott:
... Nice. You make a good point about being an entrepreneur is... it sounds glamorous. You use the word glamorous, actually. But it's not for the faint hearted. There's so many heartaches and challenges and ups and downs to it that if you really are not of that nature, and you're better off just staying with that sort of secure job where you can kind of have a reliable employment. Although, I don't know if anything is reliable these days, but at least in terms of expectations of yourself, it's a little easier path. It may be less exciting for some. It depends on your make-up, and that's what your point is. Read the first 30 pages. Take the assessment and really determine are you material for becoming an entrepreneur.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and I would just add to that, that if you are someone who does have these six essential traits, as you and I do, I'm pretty convinced that it's a psychological disorder, okay. What we do is not sane. It's not normal. We run into the fire when others are running away. We get our butts kicked most of the time, like I said. It's not all it's cracked up to be. It's these six traits combined just make for this wacky, wild individual that just loves challenges and building things. So, anyway, for what that's worth.
Will Scott:
Yeah, and we're seeing that right now, aren't we? In terms of in this environment, some of the people that are rushing to the fore are, of course, those entrepreneurs who do run into the fire, to use your expression.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, absolutely.
Will Scott:
What about the next stage then? So, they take this assessment. Let's say, so now maybe the assessment helps me understand that actually I'm better off not being an entrepreneur. Then we carry on with what we're doing, right, or perhaps find something that... at least a job-
Gino Wickman:
Listen, I advise go get a real job. I believe that like 4% of the world has these six essential traits. Then there's 96% of the world, where we need teachers and cops and nurses. We need all those other careers. I keep saying it's not all it's cracked up to be, so just decide what you're genetically encoded to do, and go deliver and provide that service to the world.
Will Scott:
... So, really, only 4%, right? That's what you expect?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah.
Will Scott:
Yeah.
Gino Wickman:
That's my experience.
Will Scott:
Did you say that we're all a little bit crazy, those 4%?
Gino Wickman:
100%. There's a great book called The Hypomanic Edge, which explains it better than I've ever seen it explained. It really just talks about how the people that came over from Europe to settle in America and build America, they were all entrepreneurs. So, we got all the crazy people over here. We got all the entrepreneurs. We got all these people with these risk taking psychological disorders-
Will Scott:
By nature, right, yeah.
Gino Wickman:
... and that's why it's such an entrepreneurial hotbed. It's slowly changing. I hope we'll still maintain our entrepreneurial spirit for the next 100 slash 1,000 years to come. But it's in our genes.
Will Scott:
Right. I'm having a thought, actually. I think, Gino, one of the most brilliant things that you came up with from your EOS days is this concept of a visionary and an integrator. Visionaries typically start businesses and have ideas and kind of evangelize and charge the future. But they're best paired with... and maybe there's a great job here for folks in these start-up or entrepreneurial companies at least, there is great jobs to be had there. One of them is being an integrator, right. That person that can support that visionary and maybe be a strength for his or her weaknesses.
Gino Wickman:
Hear, hear. Yeah, and I love that you're bringing that up. I definitely teach that in this book because I made a discovery 20 something years ago. It's that every visionary needs to be counterbalanced with an integrator, like you said. I wrote it all in a book called Rocket Fuel, if your listeners aren't familiar with it. But for that listener that's saying, "Shoot, I don't have the six essential traits, but I love entrepreneurialism. I love these entrepreneurs and I want to be part of that," you may be an integrator.
Gino Wickman:
An integrator, again, is a great counterpart for a visionary. There might be an opportunity for you to be partners in a business. I have lots of clients that are visionary-integrator duos. They're partners in the business. There's absolutely a way to hitch your wagon to a wild and crazy visionary and get all those benefits. So, by all means, there is that opportunity.
Will Scott:
Yeah, so just to make that obvious point, in fact, I think small businesses are still the largest employer in the country.
Gino Wickman:
You bet.
Will Scott:
So, if you are in a job, it might very well be in an entrepreneurial situation. As you say, you can still be an owner, potentially-
Gino Wickman:
Exactly.
Will Scott:
... but you're taking a little less risk and you're playing to your strengths, which we should all do to be of our best.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and, if I can, again, I'll try not to go on too much of a rant here, but it's such an opportunity because I wrote Rocket Fuel with Mark Winters, my coauthor. He's doing some great work. Go to rocketfuelnow.com around this. Because the reality of it is, there's only 1% of the population that are integrators. There's 4% of the population that are visionaries. So, there is a demand for integrators in the world.
Gino Wickman:
A lot of these integrators, these people that run businesses like machines, they're stuck in the corporate world. They have no idea this opportunity exists. They'll make three times more money. Mark and my passionate plea is, we're trying to pull these people out of the crevices of the world because the world needs integrators. Visionaries need integrators. Entrepreneurs need integrators. Yes, I definitely teach that in this book because I'm trying to get that entrepreneur to find their integrator sooner than later.
Will Scott:
Yeah, that's awesome. That was an interesting conversation. Okay, let's go back to the assessment. Now we've got that 4% of folks, maybe, who are getting the message and they're feeling it. How do they use your Entrepreneurial Leap material to get started?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah. Now we take them to glimpse because, again, now they're all lathered up and ready to go and they're fired up. Now I kind of give the... put on the brakes and say, "All right, before you leap, let me make your life a little easier." So, we go to glimpse. What I do in glimpse is three things. Number one, I show them countless real world stories of entrepreneurs, who were right where they are right now and how they built businesses.
Gino Wickman:
Number two, I show them a day in the life of an entrepreneur. Both the dream and the nightmare, okay. So, it can be heaven or it could be hell. Our EOS clients, obviously we teach them how to live the dream. Sadly, most entrepreneurs are living the nightmare. They're living in sheer hell. What I do is I teach eight mistakes that those entrepreneurs make and how to avoid them. So, I built two businesses, avoiding every one of those eight mistakes. It's absolutely doable.
Gino Wickman:
Then the third thing I do, and the thing that I'm most excited about, is I help that entrepreneur, who's all lathered up and ready, decide what is the best business for them. What are they drawn to? What are they genetically encoded to do? Because every entrepreneur will not succeed in every business. So, I created a tool called MyBiz Match. Again, free and downloadable on the website... not downloadable, but free on the website, because it's a functionality where you go through and you click, click, click, click, click, and out pops the perfect answer for you.
Gino Wickman:
Because your options as an entrepreneur, you have to look at all of the industries, whittle that down. You have to look at are you a product person or a service person. Two very different dynamics. I am a service person. I will never be a product person. Then you need to look at are you a B2B or a B2C. Are you a business-to-business entrepreneur, or are you a business-to-consumer entrepreneur, because those are very, very different. Are you a high price, low volume? Are you a low cost, high volume producer? As you start to look at all those opportunities, it whittles down to what is best for you.
Gino Wickman:
For me, I'm a service guy. I'm not interested in products. I want to be the highest price in town, provide incredible high value. I'm a B2B guy, so I'll just never start or build a business that is the opposite of that because it's not for me. I don't like inventory. It scares me to look at things. I'm overwhelmed by things. A million dollars of inventory sitting on the shelf gives me the heebie-jeebies, okay. Just as quickly, there are entrepreneurs that love to touch and feel and see all that inventory.
Gino Wickman:
So, you listening, or you listening that is an entrepreneur that has someone in your life, take them through MyBiz Match so they know. Now all of a sudden with glimpse, they now have clarity on, okay, this is what it looks like. This is how I can avoid these mistakes. This is what I'm drawn to. And worst case, they can go get a job for a while in that area to make sure that is what they love, because it's okay to wait a year, two years, five years to take your leap. It's just when you're ready. But go get some experience in that industry. With that clarity, we then move them to path and really get into the nitty gritty of then making that dream a reality.
Will Scott:
So, you use this word glimpse as kind of a... it's a lovely word, but is that like an aha moment, or are they sort of a... a window into this... tell us more about that specific...
Gino Wickman:
If you have the six essential traits, what glimpse does for you is shows you a vivid picture. And the way that you genetically work and the way your brain works, you are going to see so clearly. What it's going to do is light you up. It's going to make you want to move. Then again, I still caution you to not move until you read path and do everything in path. But the idea is to get that incredible visionary mind to see it. Man, once that mind sees it, more likely to happen, probably going to happen, and, like I said, lights them up.
Will Scott:
Yeah. You just can't let go of it. You wake up in the middle of the night and your heart starts pumping when you think about it.
Gino Wickman:
Hear, hear.
Will Scott:
Yeah. What if somebody has kind of had this idea in their head for 10 years? They've been working their job in the bank, but they've had this idea. Would you still encourage them to go through Entrepreneurial Leap and confirm that glimpse that they've had for 10 years, or... and possibly redirect? Or what do people do with that annoying idea in the back of their mind that's stuck there?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, for sure. The intent... and I wrote this for an entrepreneur in the making. If you think about the life cycle of an entrepreneur, from thinking I am, having my idea, taking my entrepreneurial leap, building 1,000 person company, this is for that very first step. That person that thinks they might be. That's the intention. The goal is to take them all the way to leap, okay. When they start the business and generate dollar one. That's the whole purpose.
Gino Wickman:
What I had never intended is two things. Number one, what I already shared, is when that entrepreneur of the 1,000 person company reads this book and just gets totally reinvigorated because they just read their life story. The second I never anticipated is for someone who started their business or, like you said, they got the idea, they're sitting on the idea, again, or they're in this start-up phase the first year or two. It is a great litmus test to decide did you make the right decision, should you pull the plug on this thing, or, ideally, you realize you made the right decision. But now I'm showing you the little tweaks you need to make and why it's not working for you.
Gino Wickman:
So, to that person that you described that has been sitting on this idea a long time, yes, reading this book is going to help them decide should I pursue this idea. With all due love and respect, most of them are going to decide no, but some of them are going to decide hell yes, and they're going to make wonderful tweaks to their idea because of this psychological journey I take them on, and they're going to emerge incredible entrepreneurs 10 years from now.
Will Scott:
Yeah. Then the path. So, they made that decision. They want to commit. How does Entrepreneurial help them with that phase of being an entrepreneur?
Gino Wickman:
You bet. So, with path, I'm going to give you the high level of the chapters in path in the final third of the book. I first talk about college or not. Second thing I talk about is how to find your passion. Third thing I talk about is how to find a mentor. Next thing I talk about is the power of 10-year thinking. Then I get into the eight disciplines for greatly increasing your odds for success. Then I share the nine stages for building your business. There's the high level. This is your podcast, so we can go into each one of those. Because if we went deep into each one, we would be here for about three more days and that's not fair to your audience, and you know your audience better than I do. Or you tell me what you're drawn to, but we can go into any one of those. I'll let you decide.
Will Scott:
Well, I would like to touch on each of those, at least at some level.
Gino Wickman:
Sure.
Will Scott:
Definitely the eight disciplines. I'm sure everyone's curious, "Ooh, what are the eight disciplines," because that's when the rubber hits the road, right?
Gino Wickman:
You bet, you bet. There's no question.
Will Scott:
Yeah, so, you mentioned college, finding a passion, finding mentor. I know, as an entrepreneur, certainly that I've always found... I never had to seek passion. I've just had the passion just burning in me always to do the things that I want to do. I've never needed motivation to pursue my businesses and the environments that I create for my employees. But mentoring is definitely... I've probably haven't always had a mentor, and I know that's a great thing. Tell us about your thoughts on having a mentor.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, you bet. Then, based on what you said, I'm going to just give you 30 seconds on the two chapters before that, and then I'll give you 60 seconds on mentoring, deeper. College or not is all about deciding whether college is right for you. I give all the statistics. All the facts. List of incredibly successful entrepreneurs that have a degree, that don't have a degree. And you then decide for yourself. When in doubt, you should probably go to college, but you'll understand what you're going to get out of college as an entrepreneur.
Gino Wickman:
Number two is about finding your passion. What's important for your listener to know is that you will not succeed in business without a deep passion for what you're doing, without knowing why you're doing this. Because, again, you're going to get your ass kicked all the time, many times, and the only reason an entrepreneur picks themselves back up is their reason for being.
Gino Wickman:
Now on to mentoring. With mentoring, it's not like you're destined for failure if you don't have a mentor, but mentoring is kind of a speed pass to success. I had two great mentors in my life. Sam Cupp, my business mentor, and my dad, my leadership and communication mentor. These two men shaped my life. More than half of the entrepreneurs I know and I interviewed had mentors, less than half didn't.
Gino Wickman:
So, you're going to be just fine, but the idea is to find someone who's where you want to be. For instance, in glimpse, when you do the MyBiz Match, and you know the industry that's right for you and the business that's right for you, go find someone in that business and reach out to them and see if they'll mentor you. Worst case, go work for them for free or at a greatly reduced salary or compensation. But the idea is you then reach out to those people and you just ask. You're going to hear a lot of no's. These are very busy people. But you're going to get a yes. So, you got to work it hard. Then you meet for the first time. You share your aspirations. They share their stories and insights and ideas. If it feels right, you move forward and agree on a format. I lay out the whole process for finding a mentor in that chapter.
Will Scott:
Yeah. Actually, I want to take you back now because you were talking about a purpose, sort of under the subject of passion. It's a curious thing, isn't it? A lot of people kind of struggle to find purpose. They may feel it, but even to be able to explain it and put their why, if you like, their purpose into words. Does the book help them kind of bring that alive?
Gino Wickman:
100%. I've literally taken them through a chapter giving them lots of exercises, lots of examples. I'll share one with you and your audience because I can share it in 30 seconds and it's really powerful. It had a huge impact on my life. I can't remember where I learned this, but it's a 30 minute exercise. You do it in a quiet place, totally uninterrupted. You answer three questions. Question number one you answer is what are your three greatest successes. Question number two is what are your three greatest failures. And then question number three is what has life prepared me for.
Gino Wickman:
Your passion typically stems from a wound. Pain from the past. A challenge, an obstacle, a barrier. Something you had to solve. In that, that's one of many exercises that will really help you understand. We're using the word passion. Please understand, over history, this has been called purpose, cause... Simon Sinek calls it why. There's nothing new here. This has been around forever. It's just what gets your blood pumping, man. What gets you fired up? You can call that whatever the heck you want to call it. It's just passion is a very popular term right now.
Will Scott:
One thing that I helps is it's not about you so much as about what you're doing for others, right.
Gino Wickman:
Exactly. Well, and what's funny about that... I don't want to go too deep into this, but what I created with EOS and what we teach the world with EOS is the answer to this kind of falls into four buckets. Again, I want to be careful getting too deep into this, but one of those buckets absolutely is about people, is about the customers, about serving, okay. That's certainly where mine always falls. But then there's the second bucket that's about your people inside your organization. There's some companies that it's just all about their people and building something amazing. Then the third and fourth type are... Number three is all about winning, crushing competitors, being dominant in the marketplace. And it's okay. That's important to some. And then the fourth one is all about innovation and creativity and solving big problems. Whatever words you use, they tend to fall into one of those four buckets. Again, I share all of that in the book as well.
Will Scott:
This is really cool. I feel like we're getting the book for free, in less than 60 minutes here.
Gino Wickman:
If you gave me time, I would read the whole thing to you again. I don't make a lot of money per copy, so I'm... You'll see there are nine free tools on the website. I am doing everything in my power to give this content away to the world. This truly is a passion project.
Will Scott:
That's amazing and that's very cool. Speaking of which, the audiobook.
Gino Wickman:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Will Scott:
Do we have it yet?
Gino Wickman:
Oh, yeah, no, it's in every format, all major retailers, every format that exists, you bet.
Will Scott:
Who narrated it?
Gino Wickman:
I couldn't tell you. It's whoever... I think... This is so bad. I think we went with Audible on this one.
Will Scott:
I was just wondering if it was you, speaking of reading the book.
Gino Wickman:
I don't read any of my books. These people are always shocked, because every author wants to read their book. That's the last thing on earth I want to do is read my books, so I'm leaving that to the professionals.
Will Scott:
Well, what about telling us about the eight disciplines. How would you like to do that?
Gino Wickman:
Let me skim through them for you. If one excites you and you want to dig deeper, we can certainly do that. But here it goes. Discipline number one is to clarify your vision. I'm going to give you just a quick little dissertation on each one. One of the mistakes that entrepreneurs make is they don't get clear on their vision. This is not about writing a business plan. 95% of start-ups do not need a business plan. It is a gross, ridiculous waste of time, unless you're seeking outside funds, which only 5% of companies do, then you need a business plan. But what you do need to do is get your vision on paper so you can articulate it to your people, to your vendors, to your customers, to yourself. Entrepreneurs are just terrible at doing that. It's in their head. Got to get it out of your head, on paper, in a document.
Gino Wickman:
Number two is decide if you are a partner person. This is so vital because I've helped so many partners unravel their disaster. There are three types of people walking the earth, okay. There are entrepreneurs... Three types of entrepreneurs. There are some that should never be a partner. They need to own 100% of their company, don't ever have a partner, and they're great and they're successful, and that's awesome. There are people that need to have equal partnership, be that two partners, three partners, all have equal partnership, equal voting rights. And then there are people that need to have controlling interests, but they're willing to give some equity to partners, but they ultimately have control. For what it's worth, that's me, and that's how I've always done it. With that said, you've got to decide now. I'm trying to head off a mistake at the pass, and I'm trying to give you a discipline so that you're not unraveling partnerships in the future. So, know that about yourself.
Gino Wickman:
Number three is to know that the bigger the problem you solve in the world, the more successful you will be, okay. Simply put, you cut a lawn, you're worth 25 bucks an hour. You populate Mars, you're worth about a trillion dollars. To the degree the magnitude of problems that you solve, the more money you'll make. So, if you're sitting there and you started your business and you're sucking your thumb because you're not making enough money, with all due love and respect, you're not providing enough value to your customers. You're not solving a big enough problem for your customers and clients.
Gino Wickman:
Number four is get feedback from customers and clients as early... or, I'm sorry, early and often. I'm trying to read the exact words because I can't memorize every one of these. But it's get feedback from customers and clients early and often. The whole idea here is the better you know your customer, the more successful you're going to be. You need to know your customers better than they know themselves. That's the whole secret of business, because that's where you're going to continue to evolve and change and bob and weave, and continue to create more and more value. You've got to get your ear as close to the ground with your customers as possible.
Gino Wickman:
Next is know that your first plan will not be your final plan. Simply put, it's just a mentality and an awareness and understanding that this plan, this vision that you launch with, it's going to change. 98% of the time, in all of my interviews, all of my entre... their first plan was not their final plan, almost 100% of the time. So, you just need to know that going in, and if you see the previous point, know the customer well, that's when you'll know when to make that shift on your plan.
Gino Wickman:
Number six is work hard, really hard. You've got to be fully engaged in this thing. You've got to work hard. Nothing is ever going to replace hard work in building a great company.
Gino Wickman:
Number seven. Take criticism and doubt from others with a grain of salt. When you do this, you are going to get lots of feedback. In my opinion, the worst thing you can do is go ask all your family members and literally take their advice because most of it is terrible advice. You're going to hear people telling you you're crazy, you shouldn't this, that isn't going to work. Take it all with a grain of salt because nobody knows your vision like you know your vision. Your job is to listen to all the feedback that you get from people, and then glean from it what fits best with your vision, and then you'll be incredibly successful. So, take it all with a grain of salt. Don't let it rock you because some of you, you'll have a spouse that doubts you. It's unfair and it's probably wrong, and that's sad, but then you've got a decision to make there. That's a tough one. But take it with a grain of salt.
Gino Wickman:
Then, see it every night. A woo-woo thing that I wrestled with whether I was going to put it in this book, but it's scientific. Every night when you go to bed, if you just see that 10-year goal in your mind in vivid color, it is more likely to happen.
Will Scott:
Wow, that's awesome. Thank you so much. I'm particularly interested in, and perhaps the counterintuitive one there, of taking criticism with a pinch of salt, because I'm sure we're all taught and encouraged, you know, listen, get feedback. But you're absolutely right, the most successful entrepreneurs, the most visionary ones just saw it. Steve Jobs is perhaps a great example. But they see their future and they just drive towards it. They push the naysayers aside.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and I'll give you two data points for what this... where there are two... whatever you want to call them. You don't have time to do this right now, but let's pretend you have an idea for a business. If you go ask 100 people for their advice, you are literally going to get 100 pieces of differing advice. So, let's just do the math. Okay, so then take all of their advice. You will be out of business in seven days. You can't take all of their advice, and most of it is terrible, with all due love and respect. So, you've got to glean... So, get lots of feedback. I'm a fanatic about getting feedback. 75 entrepreneurs read this book. Everything I do, I test it, hone it, try it, and get lots of feedback. You've got to get feedback. But listen, if I listen to all that feedback, this would be an awful book. I would not be in business right now. That's point one.
Gino Wickman:
Point two is there is an incredibly successful entrepreneur that I cannot say his name because I'm trying to find the source of where I heard this. Many people have said it exists, but I can't find it. I literally read it in a book, so if your listener knows where this source is... But there's an incredibly successful entrepreneur. Everyone would know this person's name. What he did is he assembled a board of what he called intelligent people. What he would do... it was 10 people. He would meet with this board and he would present his ideas to the board. If 7 out of 10 hated it, he knew he had a winner. If 10 out of 10 hated his idea, he knew it was revolutionary. They all thought that they were being intelligent advisors, but listen... We're talking about these tough times, holy shit, read 20 articles right now. You'll be twisted in a knot.
Gino Wickman:
All these people that think they know what the hell they're talking about, just pretending like they know what they're talking about. It's brutal. But, again, you just got to, same thing, you got to glean, you got to listen, you got to make your own decision at the end of the day because if you follow the herd, you're going to follow the herd right off a cliff.
Will Scott:
Yeah. I think we're talking about two different things because one of your eight disciplines is customer feedback, and you're saying seek that early and often. So, for sure, listen to what your customers are telling you. But when it comes to those sort of things, strategic things perhaps, or directional things, take criticism with a pinch of salt. You're really saying trust your gut a little bit.
Gino Wickman:
Oh, 100%. Trust your gut. Know your vision. Do everything I'm telling you in this book. But let me give you an example on what you just talked about because yes, you need to get your ear to the ground with your customers and clients, but here's what's important. They're going to mislead you. Your job... So, let's go back to me building and creating EOS. Five years, 500 sessions, testing, honing, refining all of these ideas that I had, and getting their feedback, okay. My job was to listen to their feedback. If I listened to all of their feedback, I'd be out of business today.
Gino Wickman:
So, I gleaned what I thought was best from them because I knew them collectively, 50 different companies simultaneously. If I did everything they asked me to do... "Hey Gino, can you create a program that helps us hire people better," and, "Hey Gino, can you create a marketing..." If I did everything they asked me to do, there aren't enough of me to do that, and I'd be out of business. At the end of the day, I take all of that information and I make the best decision for what I'm trying to provide to the world. So, they would've misleaded me. So please, I hope you're hearing that. Don't do everything your clients tell you to do because they'll put you out of business.
Will Scott:
That's true. That's true too, yes. But I know that's true in my own case as well, that I've kind of learned that maybe a lot of good ideas, but I tend to stick with where I think I need to be going. Of course, I want it to be more successful because I'm going to drive... that's my passion, that's playing to my strengths. Right or wrong, that's really the only way to go, ultimately, for an entrepreneur.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and here's the math. In 20 years of building EOS Worldwide, and then selling it, with 350 Implementers, with almost 100,000 companies, I've gotten 10,000 suggestions for adding something to EOS. All of which I would never do in a million fricking years, and it would've deteriorated the quality of that process. I, at the end of the day, have to make the tough decision to say, "Listen, great idea, but it doesn't fit in this thing." You got to be tough and you got to be strong, and at the end of the day, take it all with a grain of salt and then make your own decision.
Will Scott:
That's another great point because I find myself actually saying to a client the other day that the material, the six key elements of running a business, in Traction, that you wrote in 2007, 12, 13 years ago now, really hasn't changed. And the way we're implementing really hasn't changed, so definitely a-
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and just to grab that for 30 seconds, to go back to this book. These six essential traits haven't changed in 1,000 years and are not going to change in the next 1,000 years. This is who entrepreneurs are at their core. They've been around for probably 7,000 years. It's the same thing with EOS. So, anything I create, I try to make it timeless. Knock on wood, hopefully those six key components at EOS will hold true, but listen, that's all human energy. Human energy is what we've all been operating on for 10,000 years, and human energy is what we're going to operate on for the next 10,000 years. By all means, it should hold true. But we'll see. I'll never be so bold as to assume that that's the case, but I hope it's the case.
Will Scott:
... Yeah, okay. In the second part of the book, I decided that I am an entrepreneur and I committed to that, and then I get into the eight disciplines. That helps me get started with my business, right, and then... How does the book sort of end, or what's the sort of final messages in there for what's next, or how I keep the momentum, or...
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, exactly. So then I take them through the nine stages. We don't need to get into those, but I take them through nine stages. The idea behind the stages are just all awarenesses because this is what you're going to be faced with in various stages. Unfortunately, it's not perfectly linear. It's just going to help you avoid half the mistakes you're going to make. It's going to greatly increase your odds. Then I bring you to the home stretch by just talking about a lifetime of learning. What I then offer up are all the resources for entrepreneurs to stay sharp, to stay cutting edge, to stay smart, to keep growing and evolving, and that's where it all ends.
Gino Wickman:
Then I talk about... I always say there's no perfect process. There's all these people trying to teach here's this step-by-step process to building a business, to becoming an entrepreneur. There is no process, okay. Becoming an entrepreneur is not something you do, it's something that you are. If I could best describe what the process looks like, here's the best I can describe it. You have a light bulb moment, you take a leap, you get your ass kicked for 10 to 20 years, and you hopefully emerge an entrepreneur, but odds are, you won't. There's the best I can describe the process of becoming an entrepreneur.
Will Scott:
So, it's the old expression where it's not about the destination, it's a journey.
Gino Wickman:
It is.
Will Scott:
And it's a continuing and evolving process.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, and I will say, though, the thing I say, because it's 100% a journey, and then I impassionately plea... going back to the beginning of this conversation about socking money away. As an entrepreneur, pull money out of that business, sock it away forever, build your wealth by pulling cashflow out of your business. Don't think you're going to build wealth by selling that thing someday because only a tiny percentage sell your business. So, if you do what I'm telling you, and then are lucky enough to sell your business, that will be the icing on the cake. But in everything I've built, I was going to retire nicely off of the cashflow that I pulled out of my business, not off the big win. So, save 15% of everything you make, forever, and you're going to be just fine.
Will Scott:
Yeah. So, as we approach the end of the podcast, Gino, thanks so much for coming on. Clearly, a lot of my listeners are passionate about culture and my message and the stuff that I share in my book, The Culture Fix, but does the Entrepreneurial Leap touch on culture at all?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, yeah, and what it does... It kind of indirectly does because it's... culture is like, in terms of the thousand things you would want to teach an entrepreneur in the making... and so, again, that's also the way I operate. I believe in the 20/80 rule. I want to give you the 20% that's going to give you 80% of the result. So, to teach an entrepreneur in the making about culture, it's going to go right over their head. It'd be like teaching them how to work QuickBooks. It's like right now that... we'll get to that. So, but what I indirectly... I kind of trick them into thinking about culture because culture is vital. Great companies exist because of culture. So, what I do is I talk to them about know your core values.
Gino Wickman:
In those nine stages, number three is all about discover your core values. Then I also talk about the mistakes in hiring the wrong people. So, what I talk about is hire people that have your core values, know your core values. And if they'll do that, all of a sudden they'll have a culture. But the stuff that you're teaching, the stuff that we teach in EOS, that's all the stuff they need to learn once they have a few employees. But I got them on the right path and set them up well for you guys.
Will Scott:
Yeah. It reminds me of... you remember when Star Wars kind of went back to a previou... they told the story before. It's a bit like you've been helping businesses for so long, and now you're kind of going back to-
Gino Wickman:
Exactly right.
Will Scott:
... how people get started.
Gino Wickman:
Exactly. And I couldn't have done this is any other order. I couldn't have started by writing a book about helping entrepreneurs take a leap until I'd watched 1,000 of them take their leap, and watched all their mistakes, and lived in that craziness for 20 years, and 2,000 full-day sessions, which now readied me for this message.
Will Scott:
That's really cool. And now you've got a particular challenge going on right now, haven't you, Gino? Let's remind people how they can get involved with that.
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, exactly. I shot a two minute video. It's called the 16 Day Entrepreneurial Leap Challenge. The timing is crazy because it's perfect for this, where I created something called the Leap Journal. It's one of the nine free tools on the website, so this is free and downloadable. Assuming you read the book, and you believe that you might be an entrepreneur, you take the challenge. It's these times... the timing is perfect because a lot of people are laid off, they're home from school, they're twiddling their thumbs, they've got time. These are the times that spawn great entrepreneurs, brand new entrepreneurs that are going to solve the problems of the world. So, I'm urging you to take the challenge.
Gino Wickman:
What you do is you download that Leap Journal. 30 minute commitment a day for 16 days. One chapter at a time. Read the chapter. Answer the thought prompts that I give you. What it will do is it will further deepen your resolve around is this the right decision for you to take your entrepreneurial leap, and I hope that it's going to spawn a whole bunch of entrepreneurs in these crazy times. You can find that on our website. It's on our YouTube channel. You can probably just google 16 day entrepreneurial leap challenge. But it's out there and there are thousan... We literally launched that two days ago, and there are thousands. It's spreading like wildfire and hopefully it's going to make a nice little [crosstalk 00:50:43].
Will Scott:
That's awesome. And, as you say, what great timing. Perhaps too for folks, unfortunately, who may find themselves at home, either because they're home sheltering and working from home, or because a lot of people have been laid off. A lot of people in the service industry and all over are now at home thinking what next. Well, what better to do than go and discover is this their time to become an entrepreneur-
Gino Wickman:
Take the challenge, you bet.
Will Scott:
... and to use your materials and your book for that. That's really, really awesome that you've got that challenge right now.
Gino Wickman:
Nice. Thanks. Yeah, I'm excited about it.
Will Scott:
Yeah, well, so we began by talking about coronavirus and the environment we find ourselves in. Again, we've just said that this is a great time for you to go and dip some more into that, using your tools. But final thought, given the environment that we're in right now?
Gino Wickman:
Yeah, I don't know that I would say anything new from what I said, so I'm just pausing for a second. Maybe I just want to re-say and reemphasize what I said. Nobody knows what's going to happen here. There are a hand few of people that know all of the information and I'm going to trust, at the end of the day, they're going to make the right decisions for all of us. But if you look at history, this is just another crisis. Like we talked about, there's going to be another one 10 years from now, and another one, and another one, and another one. We've always endured. Hopefully we will continue to. Who the heck knows.
Gino Wickman:
In these crazy times, talk to people, help people, engage with people. Take the focus off you and put the focus on them, and it's really amazing what that's going to do for your energy, for your creativity, for your optimism, and you're going to get an idea or two. So, that would be my urging. As opposed to sitting on the couch, watching the news, sucking your thumb, woe is me, there's nothing good for you or anybody else if that's what you spend your time doing.
Will Scott:
Yeah, and let's remind these folks again that the entrepreneurial community is huge. It's not just made up of entrepreneurs, who certainly drive it, but there's the whole ecosystem of entrepreneurship. Those people that are mentoring entrepreneurs can get value from this material. Those, of course, people that are working for entrepreneurs, who could perhaps understand the entrepreneurial mindset by going through your material. So, it's a big ecosystem, and there's lots of people that can benefit from dipping into this new material, which comes from a lifetime of your work, right. Do you know? Did you say? 20 years, 30 years?
Gino Wickman:
Well, so it's been three decades of obsessing about businesses and entrepreneurs.
Will Scott:
Yeah. Well, I'm certainly delighted that we've had your time today and that Culture Czars has been able to benefit from your 30 years of business experience. Love your work to date. It's really exciting, this pivot that you're making to a new chapter in your career, perhaps the next decade, defined by Entrepreneurial Leap. So, thank you very much, Gino Wickman, for coming on the show, and congratulations. We wish you all the best of luck. Thank you so much for helping this vital engine of, not just American commerce, but global commerce with all the work that you do.
Gino Wickman:
Thanks, Will. I had a blast. It's fun.
Will Scott:
Cheers. Thanks, Gino.
Gino Wickman:
Thank you.
Will Scott:
Bye.
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